If content is king, then copy is emperor. Everyone knows or soon learns that good copy resonates with your audience and compels them to take action.
In this episode, we explore how writing gets the check from multiple streams.
Our guest, India K. Lindsey is an expert in cashing in on content after writing her way to five-figure months. The self-proclaimed Goddess of Marketing, India K, Lindsey, is a ghostwriter, academic writer, self-published author, and storytelling genius. Her company, The Write Touch, LLC, and coaching group, Marketing Mayhem is where all the magic happens!
Get ready to hear the foundation of:
•How content marketing wins the sale.
•The strategy behind digital ads.
•Monetization options as a writer.
•How writing your vision in a journal is the first step to manifesting it all.
Reach out to India for collaboration at @indialindsey on all platforms or by email at firstname.lastname@example.org.
Danielle Towner (0s): “Through careful manipulation and good storytelling, you can get everybody to clap at the same time.” Now, that’s a piece of a quote from filmmaker and producer, Steven Spielberg where he talks about how everyone with their different perspectives and different experiences can sit down to the same movie, and even bringing in unique set of experiences, they can have all the same emotional reaction to the movie of enjoyment, of laughter, of fear, of surprise.
Danielle Towner (1m 42s): You can have the same reaction with your content marketing and with your storytelling to, through your story, motivate your audience to take action on whatever call you’ve made to them—get them to respond to your call to action. Now, that’s what we’re talking about with our guest today, India K. Lindsey, of The Write Touch LLC. She breaks down every part of writing and how it can have such a powerful impact on the success of your business and the monetization portion of your business. From the idea phase, all the way down to the marketing, she talks about this and she drops so many nuggets in this episode that can help you create such a powerful impact for your clients. Keep on listening to hear from our special guest. Welcome back for another episode of Dreamer’s Den podcast. If you haven’t listened before already, I am your host Danielle Towner of Dream Work Creatives, and I help entrepreneurs build their online presence and brand awareness through website design, content marketing, and digital products. I’m glad you guys are listening today because we have a special guest with us, India K. Lindsey of The Write Touch LLC. It’s a content firm that does academic business, personal writing, and editing.
Danielle Towner (2m 43s): I’m so glad to have her as a part of the conversation today because content is such a huge part of online business. We’ve been discussing different components of online business and website design, so I’m glad to have her as a part of the discussion to weigh in her opinion as a content marketing specialist on how very important this is. Thank you for joining us, India.
India (2m 46s): Thank you so much for having me, Danielle.
Danielle Towner (2m 48s): The first thing that we want to get into is just talking about you and your journey as a writer. How did that lead to the birth of The Write Touch LLC?
India (3m 1s): I have wanted to be a writer since I was 10 years old. Reading books, I always had a love for reading and I was like, “When I get older, I’m going to be a writer.” Through college, I was advised not to study writing because it wasn’t a secure career. I ended up doing corporate communication which turned out being good because it’s taught me the business side of writing. So, I began my company.
India (3m 32s): I was actually working as a marketing director and I got fired. It was right before Christmas. I had my life’s pay check, but I needed a way to make money so I started writing. I started writing academic papers, resumes, copy; any type of writing that anyone would pretty much get me to do. That was how I begin The Write Touch.
India (4m 32s): Originally, when I wanted to legalize everything, people at the small business center were downplaying it, “See if you want this little hobby for a while, you might change your mind.” I ended doing really well. I ended up building a network. My clients were doing well with what I was providing them. It’s been four years since I started The Write Touch. Creating The Write Touch, ultimately, I knew that I wanted to write books. I wanted to do higher level writing. I wanted things to progress deeper and so creating my company helped me become an author. It helped me ghostwrite. It helped open those other avenues of writing for me.
Danielle Towner (4m 54s): Awesome. It seems like a lot of people have their story where they’re pushed into their purpose. Like you said, this is something that you’ve been wanting to do since you were a little girl. A lot of people change their mind about things, but it’s something about writers that I’ve heard several other people say that they wanted to be writers as children. It seems like it sticks with you or it comes back to you. Even as a part of what I do, I’ve always been an English and history person, and it sticks with you in your profession.
Danielle Towner (5m 29s): It’s just so crazy, like you said, that you were let go and it just shoved you into your purpose.
India (6m 19s): Yes. Sometimes it happens like that. As a kid, I didn’t know any writer. A writer was something like a singer or you heard of them but you personally didn’t know anyone in that career. I wasn’t really encouraged to pursue writing because it was, l don’t want to say a fantasy career, but it was one of those careers that I didn’t see any writers. I didn’t see anyone making a living doing writing. Even the ones who were making a living, it was like, “That’s just a hobby for them.” Growing up, I just didn’t see me being a writer. Going into college, I was encouraged even by my advisors, “You want to stick to something more solid. The creatives; that’s not really what you want to do.” I think that’s why a lot of people were– I was like, “Okay. I’m going to try it out. I’m going to do what my heart has always told me to do since I was a kid, which is to be a writer.”
Danielle Towner (6m 50s): It’s like they treated you how they do artists. It is a form of art but a lot of people are like, “Well, is there something solid there? Is there something practical that you can make money from?” Sometimes it stems from the passion and then you create ways to do that. The internet has changed the game for that. It’s created so many more opportunities.
India (7m 14s): Absolutely. It’s created a network too. Once you meet other writers who are doing it and living, it gives you like, “Okay, I can do this as well.” It gives you that sense of relief. Especially for black women, it’s like, “Okay. She looks like me and she looks like she’s living a good life on her creative career.” The internet definitely has helped with that too; finding a network of people who are in the same industry as you. That has helped as well.
Danielle Towner (7m 52s): Right. Totally. I feel the same way. How big of a role does content marketing play in the growth and success of a business? Congratulations on four years in the business. It sounds like you’re growing, and if it’s anything like my experience, the current situation has only caused business to flourish even more. How big of a role has your content marketing played in the growth and success of business?
India (8m 23s): Marketing, I would say, is the heart of business. That goes back to me being a corporate communication major. Learning how to market and how to run a business was so essential for writing. Now I’m so good at it that I have a program called Marketing Mayhem where I teach business owners, writers, all different types of business owners the importance of marketing and how to market your business. It has been fundamental in me.
India (8m 54s): There’re all types of writers, all types of business owners, but how you market yourself or where you market yourself is key to standing out.
India (9m 40s): I created Marketing Mayhem. Originally, I did a webinar on Marketing Mayhem because so many people just wanted to know my marketing strategy. How do you promote your book? How do you promote your courses? They were asking those things and I thought it was just common sense or things that everybody else was doing. When I started to do the webinar, I gave people tips on how to go viral, tips on how to create products that outsell. Doing Marketing Mayhem, l taught a lot of my writers in my group or business owners just how to market themselves. For me, it has been foundational to my growth and success because it was something that I knew how to do from my background. I was a marketing director before I was fired, and then just taking that professional experience into trial and error of different areas in my business. How I market my writing side of my business isn’t necessarily how I will market my actual books, my journals or my courses.
India (10m 17s): Just learning the foundations of your marketing for your business specifically has been helpful for me.
Danielle Towner (10m 18s): Awesome. I completely agree. I’m glad to hear somebody else say that marketing is the heart of your business. A lot of people focus so much on perfecting other areas of the business. Of course, you want a high quality product and service, and a beautiful, highly-functional website, but if you don’t market properly, then nobody is going to care about any of that. India (10m 49s): So many people, when you start a business, it seems so overwhelming. You need this, you need that. You need a website, you need all of these things. I think one of the things that get lost is the marketing. As you’ve said, you can have all of these things prepared and if you don’t have anybody to market it, you just essentially wasted all the money with your startup.
Danielle Towner (11m 15s): Exactly. What has been the most successful marketing channel for you? What marketing channel has given you the best results?
India (12m 14s): Social media. I market mostly on social media. This is where l pitch Marketing Mayhem as well. My best result for me has been Facebook and Instagram; the ability to re-target your ads to your website, the ability to run ads and it gives you a lot of insight on your customers has been helpful. I also do a lot of influencer ads. Pretty much I will contact an influencer on YouTube, on Instagram, and I have them promote my product or service. That has been very helpful as well. A mixture of both of those—using social media platforms and using the influencer on their platforms has given me tremendous results.
Danielle Towner (12m 14s): Awesome. I agree with both of those two. That’s something that we were talking about last week with ads. Some people have found success without the ads and it’s a lot more work to do so, but ads are very helpful with pulling you out of the crowd and helping you to stand out in that market and to get in front of the right people—your target audience.
India (12m 52s): Yes. No matter if your business is booming right now or not, I always stress to my people in Marketing Mayhem, make sure you are always finding new clients because it’s going to be that one day or that one season when things slow down and you’re going to be like, “Oh my God. I’ve been having a good three, four years. I haven’t had the time to do this and now things are slow.” Knowing your business seasons, like right now it’s summer so the writing portion of my business things are slow because it’s summer time. Well, it’s weird because we’re in COVID.
India (13m 27s): Normally, in the summertime, people are traveling. People aren’t really reading so my writing services always take a backseat and that’s my time to work on coaching people, work on my courses, work on my program. Knowing your business seasons and also right now we’re not going to pend much on advertisement for writing services because I know that, based on previous years, it’s my slow season. I think knowing your season in business is important too, as far as your marketing strategy. India
(13m 60s): I’d rather just save my marketing dollars for that avenue until closer to winter because that’s when that service is most lucrative.
Danielle Towner (14m 57s): Right. Exactly. I know a huge portion of ads success is the copywriting part of it and how it translates to the customer or your potential clients. Web content and copywriting; those aren’t really the first things that people think of as a part of their monetization process but they’re actually the most critical for sales. What writing advice would you give to those who are just getting started with their online business and they may not know the difference between those different types of writing and they may not be familiar with web content and copywriting?
India (15m 41s): Again, when people first start getting in business, they think that they need everything. Part of a successful business, one of the things you want to do is find people that you can outsource these things to if you’re not really good at writing. This is a writing audience so everyone listening to this is probably good at writing. As far as copywriting, speak to your audience. They always say in marketing, your audience is you five years ago. Speak to your audience the things that you would have wanted to know five years ago. Just speak to your audience as you. I always tell people in Marketing Mayhem that marketing is storytelling.
India (16m 21s): How do you tell your story to your audience? Any story. You have to get comfortable telling your story. Whether your story is, like me, I got fired and I was pushed into writing. Whenever you do any interview or anything, that’s going to be the story that is going to be told. Once you get comfortable with telling your story, when it comes to copywriting, a blog or anything like that, it’s going to be so easy because you’re already comfortable telling your story. Get comfortable telling your story and then get comfortable copywriting, as far as web content. That’s something different.
India (17m 8s): When I first developed my first website for The Write Touch as far as the website content, I just looked for websites that were similar to mine in the industry and then I wrote from there, again, what the customer needs. The customer landing on the website and the copywriting. I just recently moved to Charlotte and I was looking for a makeup artist. In the copy, I was just saying that people really need to invest in copywriters if writing isn’t their strong suit because when a customer goes on your website, they’re reading this copy. This copy wants to resonate with them. You want to talk to your customer. You don’t want to yell at your customer. Some of the websites that I was looking at, some of the copy was like, “Okay. Is this how you talk to your clients?” It was just really aggressive. I thought it was just me. I shared it with my groups and I shared to some of my business friends and they were like, “Oh, my God. I can’t believe that people are like this.” One girl was like—a lot of the makeup artists require a deposit—it was just like, “No deposit, no appointment.”
India (18m 30s): In the beginning, the girl said something like, “Book at your own risk.” I called in and I’m like, “Why would I book with you?” I think a lot of business owners do not understand how important copywriting is. Even me as a writer, sometimes I do outsource copywriting for certain projects just because you want to be very specific in your tone of writing. You want to be very specific with your audience and you can definitely lose clients by not having the right copy. Just like that makeup artist lost me as a client, her makeup was really good but when I went on her website, I was just like, “Clearly, she didn’t take the time to write this out. Clearly, she didn’t hire somebody who this was their strong suite.”
India (19m 6s): Even though I’m a writer, there are certain areas of writing that I would just outsource to someone else because they’re better at that than me. When a customer looks at your website and they want to work with you, they’re reading reviews, they’re reading the copy on your website. It could be a complete turnoff if you’re yelling at them, telling them stuff like, “Book at your own risk.” A lot of people underestimate what copywriting is and how important it is when it comes to marketing your business.
Danielle Towner (19m 9s): Yes. Definitely. You said a mouthful, but that’s completely true. You nailed it. Like you said, you have to make sure that you’re speaking in the right tone. You basically have to speak their language.
India (19m 22s): Yes.
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Danielle Towner (19m 58s): In talking to other writers and also in just talking about planning and having discussions with other business owners, they talk about journaling or physically writing things down. I’m techie, but after years of taking a break from journals, I recently started using them to jot down ideas, meeting notes, or even just jotting down things that I want to get out of my head or get off of my chest, and it’s been really helpful.
Danielle Towner (20m 32s): From your standpoint, how have journals helped you throughout your writing career and is this something that you would recommend for every entrepreneur?
India (20m 44s): Journals are dear to my heart. When I first became an entrepreneur, I always heard entrepreneurs talking about, “Journaling and having my morning routine. I have this and this and this.” It just didn’t seem like something I felt I needed to do. As I progressed into being an entrepreneur, I started to understand why entrepreneurs were into having the morning schedule, journaling, affirmations.
India (21m 16s): I do absolutely think that journaling is something for every entrepreneur.
India (21m 57s): The way I got into journaling, I had always kept journals, but I was never consistent with it. A friend of mine bought me this journal and it I had prompts in it. It was a business journal and every day it had different prompts that encouraged you to write about business. That created the habit of me journaling every day because when I opened my journal and those prompts were there, that created the habit of me journaling every single day. I love the idea of journaling on actual hard paper because when you write things down, they’re more likely to come true. Everything I have written down in my journals has come true. It’s so crazy. If you believe in affirmation you believe in manifestation. When you write things down, they come true. Me moving to Charlotte, I have been writing about moving to Charlotte since 2015. It was subtle. It wasn’t like, “Oh, I’m moving to Charlotte.” It was just like, “Oh, I’m thinking about moving to Charlotte.” Or, “I’m looking to move out of Baltimore.” When I look back, almost every journal that I have was talking about this move.
India (22m 27s): When you put things like that out onto the universe on paper, it’s like the universe starts to help you. When I really wanted to make the move, I was journaling about it more, and that’s when every opportunity came for me to move. That’s just one example of journaling. We want to hit $10,000 and $15,000 a month in my business, I would always journal about that and then I hit those numbers. Now, I’m thinking even bigger. I’m like, “Okay. I want $100,000 a month.”
India (22m 59s): I also I have several different journals, I think that every entrepreneur has. If you’re not consistent with start of from maybe just trying to finish one journal, but if you want to do several journals, that’s even better. I have one journal that everything in this journal hasn’t happened yet. It is fully a manifestation journal. Everything that I write in this journal is going to happen. I write it as if it already has happened.
India (24m 28s): I’ve written out my perfect date, my perfect day, and my perfect sales month. All these things I wrote downs if they already happened. Then I have a specific business journal that I write things in. Then I have my personal journal that I write things in. Once you get more and more into journaling, it’s like you can’t stop. I started creating my own journals from that. I have one journal, on the front, it says, “Future millionaire.” Every time I look at the journal, it’s like, “Okay, future millionaire.” I put it in front for myself. I think journaling is super important. I’m super passionate about it. Recently, we’ve just had a webinar last week on how to self-publish and create your own journals, and that was sold out. I had more than 20 attendees. I’m very passionate about journaling. I think it’s something that every entrepreneur should at least try to keep one journal. Another thing about journaling that I love is you’re documenting your life. Every day when you are going through business, it may seem like you’re not reaching your numbers.
India (25m 15s): Then one day, let’s say in 2025, you pick up a journal for 2020, and you’re going to read it and see how far you’ve come. That’s going to be encouragement. That’s what I do sometimes. I’ll pick up an old journal just to see where I’ve come. Through life, we sometimes forget things. I’ll pick up a journal from 2015, and about back then, I didn’t even have a car. I was living with my mom. I was like, “Oh, my God, five years later, I am at such a different point than I was then.”
Danielle Towner (25m 17s): You hit on a point that I’ve seen with other entrepreneurs as well, even people that are in my circle. She’s one of the people who’s like, “I wrote down seven things that I wanted to do.” When she launched the first part of those seven things, she said that this was on my list. Then she goes down on that list, then she talks about, “This is part of the seven things that I wrote.”
Danielle Towner (25m 57s): It’s the same for me. Even when I wrote down a business plan and the milestones for those, even though that’s something that you’re supposed to be consciously ticking off or working on, it’s still a part of writing that down and having that vision, and like you said, putting it in the atmosphere and making it happen.
India (26m 9s): Absolutely. It’s so true. It’s the reason that big entrepreneurs, if you watch The Secret, all of them are always saying, “Journal. Write things down, write your goals down.” It’s true, it really does work.
Danielle Towner (26m 22s): Yeah. I read the book and it was really a good book, The Secret.
India (26m 40s): I read the book and then I watched the documentary they had as well. It’s simple, then once listen to it, you’re like, “Okay. I get it.”
Danielle Towner (26m 45s): Now, you talked earlier about your Marketing Mayhem class, and then you talked about writing and how you help authors, but you teach a writing course also. Now, do you think that it’s important to learn the basics of good writing instead of just hiring a writer first?
India (27m 4s): Yes. I think it is good to learn the basics of writing skills because even if you hire a writer, they’re going to have to relay to the writer what you want them to write. So knowing the foundation of writing a story, writing a blog, or whatever type of writing this person is doing for you, it’s good for you to know the foundations of writing. I teach writing courses everywhere, how to write an eBook, and then I’m launching a course next month on ghostwriting, which has been one of the biggest streams of income in my career.
India (27m 39s): Ghost writing novels, copywriting books for other customers. Customers come to me because they have a story that they want to tell where they don’t know the foundational writing. I think you can take some basic writing courses and then use a pro writer. That gives you a better ability to tell the writer, “Hey, this is what I want to talk about,” and you met them already having written courses.
India (28m 8s): I think it’s important to have basic writing skills instead of just outsourcing that.
Danielle Towner (28m 16s): Okay. I agree. This reminds me of a story with a musician. I was in a music workshop as a kid, when your parents would make you sing in the choir and things like that. I was in a music workshop and the director was talking about how he was trying to instruct the drummer on what sound that he wanted to have, but he didn’t know the technicalities of it. As he tried to explain it to him the guy basically just said, “Okay,”
Danielle Towner (28m 50s): and he did what he wanted to do.
India (28m 51s): He said that he decided to go and take music courses, take courses on drumming so that he could learn about it and ask him, say, “Okay. This is what I want you to do.” Specifically, speak the language of that drummer, and it made all the difference in the world. I think it’s the same with writing, for you to be able to structure an outline and tell them key words. This is how I want you to close; this is how I want you to do the intro.
India (29m 25s): I think it’s important for you to get a foundation about writing if that is not something that you had in the past. Yeah. I totally agree.
Danielle Towner (29m 39s): There are options for writers to make money outside of that traditional box. This is continuing to grow as opportunities present themselves online and even offline. That’s been extremely helpful. Especially now, like you said, when it’s normally a slow season, it’s a little bit different now. Adding those additional revenue sources has been helpful. Even things like products such as eBooks and digital products, like you said, those kick in those slow seasons.
Danielle Towner (30m 14s): That’s helped your business to grow. How do you feel that can help other businesses to grow?
India (30m 25s): I think all entrepreneurs, no matter what industry you’re in, you should definitely have other streams of revenue, such as eBooks and digital products, even your podcast, YouTube, doing those type of things. As a writer, my primary source of income, my bread and butter would be writing, but I have so many other passions and things that I’ve started to get into. I always tell entrepreneurs that they should have a book because people are always going to be curious about your story.
India (30m 57s): A book is one way for people once they get to know you and they are in the getting-to-know-you stage, they can read your book. Usually, a book is $20 or less. They grab your book, they’ll read your book, they get to know. Then from there, you create eBooks online. A lot of my eBooks are on teaching entrepreneurs or writers how to write. I have one on how to write an eBook. I have one on how to make $10,000 in a month.
India (31m 30s): Just little things like that will start to build your credibility as an entrepreneur and this new person that’s getting to know you. Digital products are great as well because we live in an era now where you can send somebody an eBook. They’ll reading it, they’re able to download everything. I have a business planner and I was using this planner for myself. Every quarter, I plan out my quarter. I have been sharing it on my stories and people have been asking, “Oh, can you send it?”
India (32m 1s): That was a product I ended up creating the digital planner and I also created a workbook with my Marketing Mayhem course. Everybody who was in there, they usually ended up buying the workbook. The workbook is really great because it’s 100 pages and it goes over your whole strategy. Things that you may have not considered in marketing; we have this whole workbook to go through and help you from the beginning of your marketing strategy.
India (33m 20s): It’s little things like this you can create. I am primarily a writer, but when you start to do other things, branch out to marketing, branch out as a ghostwriter, branch out as somebody who has developed journals, you can then monetize all of that. With me creating my own personal journals, people started to come to me. They were like, “Okay. Can you help me create a journal?” I created journals for people. I also create journal templates, where a journal template that I sell to a customer they can literally go upload it on Amazon [inaudible], and they’ll have their own journal the next month or the next week actually. It takes like a week, so the next week they have their own journal.
India (33m 51s): Apart from that, people were like, “Well, I want to learn how to do that.” I created the journal webinar and the journal course. Every little thing, you don’t have to monetize everything that you do, but I think it all ties into your business. Then that’s how you start to create different eBooks and digital products that eventually help your business grow. I always see people and they’re like, “Well, I don’t know what they talk about.” They’re like, “You have some eBooks and digital products. How do you what to talk about?” When my audience comes to me with something, I create a product. If somebody comes to me with a question, if several people come to me with a question, that’s a product. If more than one person come to you for that, then that’s something that people want to see from you. A question is a product. Customers come and say, “How do you do a journal?” That’s usually not a quick question. So I developed the course and a webinar to teach people how to do these things, to help them ultimately grow their business.
Danielle Towner (34m 25s): You nailed it right there when you said that when people come to you or more than one person is coming to you with this question, then that’s a product. That’s market research right there. It’s market research at your fingertips.
India (34m 39s): Yes. Some people don’t take it that your audience is there for a reason. I’ll listen to my audience. I poll my audience a lot. I post on Facebook or my Instagram stories or whatever other sites l am on. This year so far I’ve done several webinars. My last webinar was the best-selling webinar. I made over $2,000 from just this one webinar. I’ll say, “Webinars have become my thing.” I called my audience and said, “What do you want from me next?”
India (35m 13s): A lot of them gave me things that I didn’t even think about. Sometimes we just need to ask our audience, “Hey, what do you want to see from me next?” That’s content right there. That’s an eBook. That’s a digital product that we may have not even thought about. Sometimes just polling your audience gets you new content as well.
Danielle Towner (35m 33s): Right. Like you said, you don’t have to monetize everything, but I think when people are just getting started, they’re trying to figure out, “Well, how can I make money?” Or, “How are these people making this money?” They don’t think about things like that. Like you said, that’s a product, that’s a service. Those are some very unique ideas on how to monetize your skills and your expertise. Like I tell my audience, you take those poor ways of making money online and you be creative and you create things from there.
India (36m 13s): You have to be creative and it’s trial and error. Sometimes you may create a product and it’s not your best seller, you can go back and tweak something on it. Sometimes we create something and it’s off the shelves, it’s sold out. Listening to your audience is the foundation of creating products that people want. Listen to your audience, listen to that gossip, that negative feedback, and that helps you create more and more products for the future.
Danielle Towner (36m 41s): Exactly. Well, you definitely presented yourself as an expert on this podcast and giving so much good information. If our listeners want to reach out to you again, how can they get in touch with you for help with their content or just to join your tribe and to learn from you?
India (37m 1s): I am @indialindsey on all platforms, I am India Lindsey on Facebook. My website is still being developed, but I do have a Gumroad that has all of my online workshops, my classes, my eBooks, and other digital products. There are some journal templates on there if you want to create your own journal. That is gumroad.com/indialindsey. I am India Lindsey on all platforms. I’m pretty friendly so tweet me, reach out to me.
India (37m 35s): My email is email@example.com if you just want to shoot me a question and that’s getthewrite, G-E-T T-H-E W-R-I-T-E.com
Danielle Towner (37m 56s): Awesome. Well, thank you for that information, and thank you for joining us on the platform as a guest. India (-): Thank you so much for having me. Danielle Towner (-): Awesome. India
(38m 3s): This was a great conversation.
Danielle Towner (38m 4s): Yes. Absolutely. Now, for everyone out there listening, if you have any immediate questions and you’re listening from the Anchor platform, you can press the record button and you can ask your question and we’ll get back to you. You can ask your question in the comments if you’re listening from the website from danielletowner.com. Other than that, join us back next week for another enlightening discussion. As I always close, dream until your dreams come true.